Intelligence behind the universe

[RunningScroll]

Been in a discussion with an atheist, and thought that this response to her was strong, Kind regards, Dylan:

One needs to debate whether incremental random chance is enough to explain the myriad of rich phenomena observed. Are long periods of time sufficient to produce what is observed? (I am not one who believes the universe has been around for a few thousand years) Or is it possible that long periods of time + intelligence is required?, that's where I lean. You are here applying your own atheism of the gaps argument of randomness + sufficient time, reflecting your own bias. I would also ask you to unpack your own phrase "a universe figuring itself out". You need a WHO or at minimum a mind to do any figuring, otherwise it needs to be described as a universe "building itself", and has nothing to do with intelligence. A purely physical universe, could have no awareness of itself, and any apparent awareness would have to be described as a "pure illusion", there is no room for WHOs in this universe, and yet humans exist as exquisite WHOs. Therefore WHOs i.e. intelligence is a universe prerequisite.

[happyrain]

Hey Dylan!

I saw your name appear in another post the other day and meant to comment. Just want to say it's nice to see you on the forums again!

I hope all is well. I hope the relationship between you and your friend is a harmonious one.

[Sandy]

Hi Dylan,

It's great to see you! Your words sounds strong to me...I'm convinced... .

xxSandy

[RunningScroll]

Nice to hear from you both!

[Starwalker]

That is a strong argument indeed. I have had my share of conversations with atheists too, but I’ve stopped debating the existence of God. The last time I reached out to an atheist my main message was that Jesus still loves you even if you don’t return the affection. I think that is what they really need to hear. I often find that their criticisms of faith are founded in some regards since they are usually a rebuttal of outdated belief systems. Sadly, their search often ends there. I find that there is very little you can do to sway the mind of someone who has turned against God to the point of denying His existence. Though someday I believe humanity is destined to discover that there is nothing that can take the place of God in human society. Though we are likely going to have to learn this the hard way.

The God in me salutes the God in you,
Jonathan

[Sandy]

Hello Dylan and Jonathan,

I've been missing quite a bit the past couple months with the move and wanted to say hello to both of you. When it seems words don't have any effect maybe we can just let our love do the talking, eh? You guys are awesome!


xxSandy