Healing-Prayer Request

Post any prayer or healing requests here.
Desideratum
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Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Desideratum » Wed Jul 16, 2014 6:52 pm

Hello, I am new to this forum, so let me just say hi to everyone. I have an ongoing situation with a friend/potential love interest. I won't go into the whole story as it is rather long. The upshot is that she has some past experiences/huts/betrayals, etc that are deeply affecting her behavior.

Recently she experienced a loss, a beloved pet had to be put down after losing a battle with disease. After that she kind of shut me out, didn't tell me about it, and was misleading about some other things. I had been very supportive of her, helping her in any way she asked. Being brushed off like that was a horrible feeling.

I waited a week, hoping she would talk to me and explain things to me, but she did not. I got upset, told her I felt as if she didn't care or consider me, which is what was happening, really.

That just caused a deeper rift, we haven't talked in a month. this kind of thing has happened before, she is just unwilling or unable to talk openly about these things. I have been totally depressed, anxious, feeling hopeless about it... she just will not talk to me.

So my request is that she forgive me of whatever it is she perceives I did to her, and that she want to communicate and reconcile. We need a serious emotional healing here, I love her ...there is no doubt about that, I really think we could have something together, but this has to be healed.

I am open to any help I may receive.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Sandy » Thu Jul 17, 2014 5:26 am

Hello Desideratum,
It is hard to love someone and yet be excluded at times from them, those parts of life that seem most crucial and vital. perhaps it is important that we keep in mind that we are all different and so too handle the crucial things of life differently one from another. Grief, in particular, can affect people in various ways, possibly depending on where they are in the healing process or even if they are stuck somewhere in the process of letting go of the worst of the pain and heartache. Divorce, relinquished love,any loss regardless of the source can put us in a tailspin making recovery sometimes a long and arduous process.
I must admit when I am hurting I often prefer to be off to myself and deal with the feelings privately, telling people when I am ready or feel the need for the extra help.

I will pray for your friend and for you, Desideratum, for understanding and vital communication between you that can provide healing in this relationship.
Let's face it, we can never have too many friends so when one seems lost it can hurt deeply. I am so sorry you are experiencing this ache. I send you love and pray that God provides the needed "balm" to gently lead you through this.
Love and God Bless,
Sandy
Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Desideratum » Thu Jul 17, 2014 7:04 pm

Thank you, Sandy. Her trouble handling this current issues is part of the problem. She dissociates from things she cannot face. Past traumas must be haunting her, things that she never dealt with.

As for me, this has been one of the most difficult times in my life, this particular episode and some others with her as well. It seems like it wold take a genuine miracle for this to be resolved. That is why I have been trying to let go and process my own despair as best I can...I cannot tell you how deeply I loved/love this woman ... but her state now makes sharing that with her impossible.

I know god - who made an immeasurably vast and beautiful universe, can heal both of us in a blink. It would be, perhaps, the greatest gift in my life to have that come to pass.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by 11light11 » Sat Jul 19, 2014 3:35 pm

Dear Desideratum,

My heart goes out to you in this sad time. I can relate to the situation you are in. We all have different feelings and responses to these things, but I know for me, I can recognize that inside of me I have a hope to help people who are suffering and struggling. I have sometimes invited people into my life, or cared for people the most, when I know they are in need of help, though I didn't realize it at the time. I think that it is tough to sort through that and recognize, some of the attraction (or for me, most of it) has come from a desire to help and a desire to make a difference, in turning that person's life around.

If someone is really hurting, and turns from a dear friend while they are in pain . . I am not sure what we can do to convince them that opening up to the relationship is a healthy move. Some people, that is how they face pain and loss -- alone. There are complicated reasons why they do that, but it's already a pattern, and has nothing to do with us. For some it's not comfortable, and doesn't feel safe either, turning to another person in times of stress and pain.

I think all we can really do is let that person know we are there if they need us. Short of that, pushing will likely make the resistance to comfort even stronger.

So I know how you feel when you say it seems hopeless. Love is something that is either simple or impossible. If you have to ask for it, it just makes it impossible. I suppose apart from looking at her behaviors, all you can do is be true to your own heart, and put your warmth and love out to your friend while she is in need. If she accepts you into her life and takes comfort from what you offer that is wonderful. But sometimes the other person just doesn't want that comfort and I know how sad that makes you feel.

Will be thinking of the both of you . . . with love, Michele :loves

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Geoff » Sun Jul 20, 2014 12:43 am

11light11 wrote:If someone is really hurting, and turns from a dear friend while they are in pain . . I am not sure what we can do to convince them that opening up to the relationship is a healthy move. Some people, that is how they face pain and loss -- alone. There are complicated reasons why they do that, but it's already a pattern, and has nothing to do with us. For some it's not comfortable, and doesn't feel safe either, turning to another person in times of stress and pain.

I think all we can really do is let that person know we are there if they need us. Short of that, pushing will likely make the resistance to comfort even stronger.
Dear Michele,

yes I think you are absolutely right. What we can try and do is send healing, remote healing, but again if they are not open to it, it just won't reach them. So where does that leave the situation?
Desideratum wrote:I know god - who made an immeasurably vast and beautiful universe, can heal both of us in a blink. It would be, perhaps, the greatest gift in my life to have that come to pass.
Yes but the most sacred thing is free will. To receive healing, you REALLY have to be open to it at a soul level. You can't fake this. As also, for some types of healing, but not all, you need faith. We can pray for others, but we can't impose our desires on their life. Excepting for the most universal sort of prayer which is to see the person heal and grow. Which of course is what Father desires for all of us. But Father has all eternity to see this happen and we hope to see it happen in months or a few years at most. I guess the question is whether this person is comfortable in their pain, or is ready for change, and willing to seek out someone to help with that change?
11light11 wrote: I suppose apart from looking at her behaviors, all you can do is be true to your own heart, and put your warmth and love out to your friend while she is in need. If she accepts you into her life and takes comfort from what you offer that is wonderful. But sometimes the other person just doesn't want that comfort and I know how sad that makes you feel.
Sadly I have to agree that that is where its probably at.

hugs
Geoff
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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Desideratum » Sun Jul 20, 2014 8:43 pm

Thanks for the replies...
I have supported her, when she was in need of it recently. She was upset over something, and I was there for her, held her as she cried, etc. But once the situation came to a head, I was essentially out the door. She literally brushed me off. I let her have her space, for a week or so, then a friend of mine passed away suddenly. I suppose the combination of my friend dying and the feelings associated with the woman was too much, I called her out on it. I told her I felt snubbed and brushed off ... because, in truth, I was.

I emailed her and tried to explain, letting her know I understood her feelings, and what mine were. I invited her to talk things out with me, but she wasn't having it. This is the second time this kind of thing has happened. The first was over something totally ridiculous, and I actually apologized, sent flowers, etc. Little did I know that she can be a vacuum for attention and self-pity, and will hurt anyone close to her if/when the triggers are there.

She is not getting any younger, I may very well be the best thing that has come along for her in a long time, I can forgive just about anything, save for betrayal, maybe. And I am willing to hear any and all grievances she has, I am fearless that way, from years of meditation, spiritual seeking, etc. I think it will be on me to reach out this time ... if she can hear it, or is willing to talk, fine, if not, I fear she will go on to be unhappy and destroy relationships for many years to come.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Geoff » Sun Jul 20, 2014 11:16 pm

Dear Desideratum,

Take heed of my personal experience and the pain of a marriage that lasted over 20 years. I thought I would be "good" for her. The only person who can ultimately change someone in this much pain, is that person themselves. A partnership should not be based on one party needing to support the other almost permanently. No one can carry another indefinitely. It does not work. And what I hear you saying here, is she has very deep seated issues. That does not mean she can't heal, but she has to first of all take responsibility for who she is, and then want to change. My ex-wife did neither.

hugs
Geoff
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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Desideratum » Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:08 am

Yes, I understand your point, Geoff. I sent a text to her, just saying hello essentially. In a while I will follow up with mentioning that she has some DVDs that I would like back. That will quicken things one way the other.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Geoff » Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:28 am

Dear Desideratum,

I am sure you are familiar with self-fulfilling prophecies? I would guess she will congratulate herself that you are as she suspected, yet another male that wants to cut and run, like all the rest before you. Of course you are quite the opposite, but .....

I will be happy to be proved wrong, and I am sure you would agree with that too. I often think if I were to have my life again, I would choose to study people and the masks of self-deception they create. Its fascinating. I recently read a best seller book called The Examined Life by Stephen Grosz. No real "answers" but he draws back the curtains on many a disturbed person.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Desideratum » Mon Jul 21, 2014 12:51 am

Geoff,

It appears on one hand it is wise not to expect someone who is so unable to and/or unwilling to communicate to ever change, and on the other hand to bring about a change in the relationship, an end to it if that is what is meant to be, is going to convince her that I'm just another one to cut-and-run. She is one of many that would rather be right than happy. In her mind I'm some kind of devil, I DARED question her after she treated me disrespectfully, rudely and selfishly. Its only out of my feelings for her and knowing of her suffering that I didn't cut and run the first time this happened ... and I would have been not only justified, but encouraged to do so for my own well being.

Now she wants me in limbo ... not there but not gone? That simply makes no sense. I haven't sent the second message yet. I wonder what she will do when I do. If she continues to ignore me I will either call, or get serious, like "I'm coming there to get mt DVDs soon, please have them ready for me."

Meanwhile, the feeling in my stomach is pretty bad...

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Geoff » Mon Jul 21, 2014 1:11 am

Desideratum wrote: She is one of many that would rather be right than happy. .
Aah yes, that causes pain so often, so very often. In the end she is entitled to her choices, even if they result in pain.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Desideratum » Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:06 am

She is entitled to her choices....no I do not think so. A murderer is not entitled to their choice to kill someone. They take something to which they are not entitled out of a selfish, pathological and unethical need. Dawn (her name) is not evil, but she is perpetrating something on someone who only tried to show her loving kindness. She does not have that right. She is taking it from me, and the universe at large, at great cost to both myself and her.

She doesn't have to care about me, love me, or even like me. But she is wrong to take support and love from me and return disrespect and cruelty. The aggrandizement of one's ego, and selfish need to be "right" at the expense of another person's heart is most definitely not anyone's right. A simple acknowledgement, apology, a sign of wanting to make amends is all it takes to clean things up.

I know it is born of her pathology, that she cannot help it, I was praying for an opportunity to forgive her, at the very least, so that she ceases to get all this free rent in my head. I will still have to continue to pray for peace and process the anger, sadness and disappointment that is constantly arising in me. I'm left saddling this burden while she pretends I don't exist...

I know I'm bitter ... obviously, but I believe I am correct. Her retribution for her actions will not come from me, if I am not in her life especially. Being alone and "right" vs. less right, and far happier may be her fate.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Desideratum » Mon Jul 21, 2014 4:25 am

Well, in any event, I did text to say hello and was ignored. I texted 4 hours later requesting my DVDs back and got a reply within a couple minutes, asking for my address.

So, that's that.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Geoff » Mon Jul 21, 2014 4:40 am

Desideratum wrote:She is entitled to her choices....no I do not think so. A murderer is not entitled to their choice to kill someone. They take something to which they are not entitled out of a selfish, pathological and unethical need. Dawn (her name) is not evil, but she is perpetrating something on someone who only tried to show her loving kindness. She does not have that right. She is taking it from me, and the universe at large, at great cost to both myself and her.
Dear Desideratum,

I have to disagree. The Universe ALLOWS a murderer to murder, IN THIS REALM. Thats what free will is. (But entitled suggests there is no price to pay, so its not an appropriate word.) I think a bit of Buddhist perspective might help here. She can do nothing to you. It is your response that is your responsibility. It seems that you have invested something here, and expected a better return. The Buddhist teach that if someone annoys you, its your own problem. I accept that entirely, and thats what you have here.
Desideratum wrote:I know I'm bitter ... obviously, but I believe I am correct. Her retribution for her actions will not come from me, if I am not in her life especially.
Well thats a relief. All you do by "paying her back" is create compensation for yourself. And thats what I did in my marriage, and the image I had of my soul condition after that 20 odd year period made me cry for several weeks. Heave a sigh of relief, and move on. That is my advice.
Desideratum wrote:She doesn't have to care about me, love me, or even like me. But she is wrong to take support and love from me and return disrespect and cruelty. The aggrandizement of one's ego, and selfish need to be "right" at the expense of another person's heart is most definitely not anyone's right. A simple acknowledgement, apology, a sign of wanting to make amends is all it takes to clean things up.
You are not displaying unconditional love. You are expecting her to return what you gave. And you can't expect that. (In her case here it seems she is incapable of it anyway.) You may get that love returned, but you can't expect it. But I also agree that a relationship cannot survive on this sort of basis where one party displays no love to the other. Real unconditional love is sadly rarer than it should be. I certainly love my cat unconditionally, as he has a very short temper, and bites and scratches. I often tell him I have no idea why I love him. I think most parents love their children unconditionally. It would be interesting to speculate as to whether a good "equal" relationship is actually based on a love that expects a return, or unconditional love. Because unconditional love will put up with things that should not occur in a balanced relationship. And the relationship of parent to child is not that of two equals. The child needs the unconditional love, too.

hugs
Geoff
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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Desideratum » Mon Jul 21, 2014 7:03 am

This is an interesting conversation, I appreciate it...

We humans are not really capable of real unconditional love. I love my cat, too, and he also bites. But mostly he is a good cat. If he were to attack and bite me ferociously, and constantly, I might not love him so much.

Regarding free will, I do believe that although it is real, to our perspective, it is still an illusion. But for most practical purposes we experience it here in this world as being real. BUT ... there are consequences. If you murder, you will likely lose your freedom or even your life, and that is good because you pay the universe back for your actions. If you suck up love and kindness from me during a time of need, then later brush me off and express coldness and cruelty, it would be right to get back coldness, dismissiveness, etc in return. For me to take it upon myself to deliver that payback is another thing, it binds me to the suffering and keeps me attached, and really wouldn't feel good, if I were honest with myself. But she will get it, actually she's in it now, as she rejects me, she rejects a life of love, devotion, passion, etc the likes of which she will never know. Gee, I wonder how such a beautiful (which she is) woman can be in her late 40s and still single?

Re my experience being my responsibility ... yes that is true. There is an old Zen story about a monk who was attacked and killed by a bandit, and while he was being murdered he was screaming in absolute terror. At one point a young novice asked one of the other senior monks how the poor guy could have reacted that way. Wasn't he enlightened? Didn't he have total detachment from his body and mind? How could he scream in terror and agony just like anyone else? The answer was that he screamed in terror and agony because he was being slain violently and horribly by a bandit with a sword.

So what does that mean? Feelings and emotions arise, it is an unavoidable truth of human experience. I do not CHOOSE to be heartbroken because one I loved so dearly has turned out to be a heartless bitch and treated me like garbage ... the sadness, anxiety, etc I experience happened as a result of my experience. No doubt there are unhandled traumas in my past that caused me to become so attached.... knowing that does not help. I have to scream in agony as her treatment of me slices through me...I have to experience that pain. The only way I know how to do it is to welcome the horror and let it happen, NOT to fight it, NOT to say "I shouldn't have this."

I will say this, I do CHOOSE to be free of it. I choose to have NO triggers, no leftover pain, no negative associations, and only peace in this regard. Its funny, I came here to learn about how I can ask angels to help me, and got the answer I usually get when celestial beings, god, etc don't help me, or us humans in general. They choose not to, or the answer is not what I want to hear, or its something unexpected, or I am too low to understand it .. just have faith, just know that god loves me...the universe allows murders to murder.... This is not such a great world. If there are supreme beings, they are very selective on when and who they help.

I need to get back to meditating, that is the one place where I can witness a real miracle ... it doesn't fix my "life" but at least I can experience my Life.

Again, I apologize for being bitter ... its just how I feel right now.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Geoff » Mon Jul 21, 2014 7:16 am

Desideratum wrote:Regarding free will, I do believe that although it is real, to our perspective, it is still an illusion. But for most practical purposes we experience it here in this world as being real. BUT ... there are consequences. If you murder, you will likely lose your freedom or even your life, and that is good because you pay the universe back for your actions. If you suck up love and kindness from me during a time of need, then later brush me off and express coldness and cruelty, it would be right to get back coldness, dismissiveness, etc in return. For me to take it upon myself to deliver that payback is another thing, it binds me to the suffering and keeps me attached, and really wouldn't feel good, if I were honest with myself.
Dear Desideratum,

It would appear that this is all regarding this realm. It is possible to murder, do drugs, cheat lie and live in a mansion in this world. We can debate whether that person is happy, but they can certainly have all the material comforts and escape "justice" here. But the Universe will exact its toll. And even if they do get caught here and pay for their mistakes here, the universe will likely still exact a toll later, because few of these people actually change, and the toll that the universe exacts is based on WHO YOU ARE, at that moment, and pays no concern to what you were, or how long you have been like that.

Free will in this realm is unlimited. You can do whatever. But in the next realm it is not. There the "Law of attraction" is above the Law of Free Will. So you cannot escape justice. Because by living with people EXACTLY like you are, justice is served. And you cannot will yourself somewhere else.
Desideratum wrote: Gee, I wonder how such a beautiful (which she is) woman can be in her late 40s and still single?
No surprises there, the rest of the men found out just the way you did.

Desideratum wrote: I need to get back to meditating, that is the one place where I can witness a real miracle ... it doesn't fix my "life" but at least I can experience my Life.
Yup its always amazing.

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Geoff
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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Desideratum » Mon Jul 21, 2014 5:56 pm

I am not sure what goes on in other realms, nor is it any concern of mine. By that I mean I am in this realm, and I have to deal with the laws of physics, laws of attraction and play the roll I was given. The only good thing about this recent experience is that I found out who she was before too long, it hasn't been years of my life thrown away, just months. I fell really hard for her for a few reasons - I knew her way back in the past for a while and was really into her then but didn't get to know her that well. So I am left with having to get over this, Now that seems like it wold take a miracle.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by 11light11 » Tue Jul 22, 2014 1:38 am

Dear Geoff,

I am so glad to see your responses. ;) It's wonderful seeing your smiling face, and I enjoyed reading your messages. I agree so much with what you are saying, and can empathize with what you've shared about your experiences with your ex-wife. It reminds me so much of what my therapist shared with me many years ago. She was dating a disturbed young man when she was a teenage girl, mainly because she felt sorry for him, and could see that underneath it all, he had a good heart. Her mother grew concerned, and confronted her. She said, "If you can only be with one person anyway, why choose someone you need to help?" This simple statement had such a lasting impact on her that she was able to share it with me, some 30 years later. And I in turn have shared it with countless of my own clients. :) Wise words from a wise lady.

Desideratum,

I really do understand so well what you are going through. I've read your updates on the situation and it really is so very sad. My heart goes out to you. I am sorry to hear about your recent loss as well. Dealing with the death of a friend at a time like this is truly awful. I sometimes wonder about the strange timing of things in life. Sometimes it seems as though the pain is compiling, and right when we are already suffering, more pain is heaped right on top.

But in your case I can't help but wonder. As you said, you have recently been there for your friend -- and have tried to be there for her more times than she's allowed you to be, right? But then suddenly it was you who was in need, and you were disappointed by her lack of compassion for you. In a sense this is the blessing in all this -- it allows you that opportunity to guage for yourself the quality of this relationship. We aren't able to judge the quality of her being, not only because we'll never know, but also it's not our job, nor our right. But you always have the right to assess the quality of a relationship, and whether or not it works for you. And when you feel that the person isn't there for you in a way you wish they would be, that has merit in your own life, right? I think so often we feel we have been 'unfair.' But it's not as much about 'fair' and 'unfair' as it is about honoring ourselves, and respecting our personal needs. If you feel you've been neglected, and you're giving far more than you receive, you're just noticing things are out of balance. I can only imagine how painful this has been for you and I'm so sorry. It's very disappointing to realize a relationship isn't developing as you'd hoped it would. But I hope for you that in time you will have an even better understanding of what works best for you, and will attract that into your life.

I will be thinking of both you and your friend and wishing you both the best. Take care and peace to you.

Lovely hearing from you, Geoff. :kiss: Peace, Michele :sunflower:

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Geoff » Tue Jul 22, 2014 1:53 am

Dear Michele

:kiss:

Thanks and many thanks for your insights. I loved the one about "if you can only be with one person..."

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Sandy » Tue Jul 22, 2014 3:26 am

All three of you guys are awesome! :kiss: I have been reading and thinking about the back and forth conversations in regards to my own past relationship and it has been very helpful in helping me to understand and to look a little more clinically and with less emotion at this long failed relationship. Desideratum, you are a special person and I am grateful to you for your courage in sharing something very painful and personal with us. I know this is small consolation in regards to the pain you are experiencing but I think your openness and this discussion can help those who are experiencing their own inner torments.
I continue to pray for your peace and happiness.

With love,
Sandy
Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.

~ Chief Seattle ~

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Desideratum » Tue Jul 22, 2014 5:19 am

Thanks everyone...

Michele, it was just what you said, the feeling that I didn't matter, that I had to sell out my self respect and dignity, maybe not to a huge degree, but many times to a fair degree. I just didn't feel right. even after I told her about my friend who passed away, I cot nothing from her. I know she's not evil, she is just unbalanced and emotionally disturbed. Logically I should be able to let this go easily. I wouldn't get plugged in if a drug addict or mentally ill person did something against me, because I would know better than to take it personally. But in this case I took it personally, because when her guard is down and she is being normal, she is so attractive, compatible and adorable to me... To have that same person shun me and turn on me is brutal. But, I took the stand and now am paying the price.

Thank you all for the supportive thoughts and prayers, I happily accept any and all good that I can receive and am glad this discussion is helping others.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by 11light11 » Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:41 pm

Hi Desideratum! :hithere

You know, it really is so hard what you're describing. I think for those of us who have been in a similar situation, what makes it so hard is when the person swings back to the 'nice person' we know they are capable of being. That 'nice person' is so compelling, and we want to find them the whole truth. But the problem is that people are package deals. If someone is sometimes disrespectful, short-tempered and volatile, or in any way violates our sense of self or causes us to feel poorly, that aspect to their personality is inside of them even when they are being 'nice.'

I already quoted my old therapist in an earlier message, but she comes to mind again. ;) She had shared with me years ago that so many clients come in complaining of poor treatment from their partner, but then protest that this person is very 'nice.' She said, "What does 'nice' even mean? This isn't a personality trait. Everyone can be nice if they are in the right mood. Eva Braun was known to have said that Hitler was nice, even quite tender, and I've no doubt he was, when he was with her."

She suggested instead looking at things in terms of range. What is this person's range? She said, for instance, with my husband and I, of course we get angry with one another. That can't be helped. But whether we are in a good mood or a bad one, whether we agree or disagree, we always speak respectfully with one another, and we each allow the other to keep their dignity. We don't hurl accusations, take a person down to an insecure place, or push buttons we know are there only because the person has felt safe enough to be vulnerable and honest. That is unfair.

She held out her two hands, and said, "This behavior that you're describing" -- referring to my ex -- "This is way out here." She held her left hand way out to the left. "This is the worst he's capable of. And it's not so good at all. It's bad stuff -- you're left feeling just awful." Then she held out her right hand way out to the right. "The best he's capable of is somewhere way out here. He apologizes, he's thoughtful, he brings you flowers, he's 'nice.' " She shook her head. "Look at this range." Her hands were very far apart. "His range is huge. This is a very volatile and unpredictable person, and you never know which end of the range you're going to get."

She talked about her husband, a quiet man with a passive aggressive tendency a mile wide, but who never raised his voice, shouted, or behaved in a hurtful manner towards her. She showed how his very worst behavior and his very best behavior were very close together -- his range was miniscule. Her two hands were almost touching, as she described his range. And hers of course was also miniscule.

The other thing she explained is that her husband's "good end" isn't as flowery and showy. He doesn't gush, declare love, bring flowers and all that romantic stuff -- both the left and right side are mild. For people who desire the showy end of the right side of the range, they aren't as likely to find that in a person who has a moderate left side. In other words, people who are capable of extremely hurtful behavior also tend to be capable of the really good stuff -- the movie-cliche-romantic stuff. While people with more moderate or tiny ranges, they aren't going to provide that knight-in-shining-armor quality to the relationship -- but they also won't hurt you. So part of the maturing process, in love, is to give up that fantasy about being worshipped, because someone who is capable of that is just as likely to be abusive in a different mood. My therapist's husband was not the gushy type, but he was steadfast, loyal, faithful and true. And that matched the rest of the behavior -- the fact that he would not demean or abuse someone. Doesn't that make sense when you think about it? ;) Hollywood's messed with our heads, there is no question. ;)

That was 14 years ago, and it changed my life. I never thought of individuals the same again -- nor myself. We all do have a range. How broad is our range?

We get into so much trouble longing for the behavior indicated by that right hand, which is held way far out to the right. ;) The trouble is that the behavior indicated by the left hand is just as real, and as integral a part of that person's complex whole. A reliable partner has neither the far-right nor the far-left behavior. It took me years to really get that. ;)

Ultimately it's our job to determine how far to the left we're willing to go. What is best for us varies, and some of us will be able to put up with things others couldn't. So it's not about fair or unfair -- it's about our unique sensibilities. If something doesn't feel right, it probably isn't.

When I read what you are going through I flash back to all those invaluable discussions, and I'm so grateful for my therapist's wisdom. I hope sharing it with you offers you just as much to think about and take comfort from as it did me, all those years ago. :love Because adorable or not, so much of your friend's behavior is causing you pain. Is her range right for you?

Peace to you, Michele :sunflower:

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Geoff » Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:20 pm

11light11 wrote: A reliable partner has neither the far-right nor the far-left behavior. It took me years to really get that. ;)
Me too. I had a sister who was manic depressive, and a mother very close to that, and so I grew up "used to" these huge swings. And so I chose a partner that did that too. Many many years later I deliberately sought out a partner that in my youth I would have described as "boring". Now I see that "boring" is just wonderful. Its not boring at all, its just balanced.

hugs
Geoff
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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Desideratum » Mon Jul 28, 2014 12:40 am

Good points, Michele...

My gal's range is interesting... she doesn't rage, or explode, she just runs away. She dissociates, turns a cold shoulder and disconnects. I don't like it, it makes me feel unappreciated and not considered. I KNOW that she does this out of self-preservation, but it still feels disrespectful. I did't move to end things with her over this, just to confront it and talk it out. SHE ended things over it. Such a relatively trivial matter and just submerged into the icy depths and swam away.

No, that is beyond what is acceptable for me. So for that reason I did not send flowers begging for forgiveness. The first time she did this I actually did send flowers and apologized (for something I still don't fully understand). But I cannot live like this, selling out for her approval, even if I do love her. I had to pick my pain, so I picked the one of dignity, and hopefully will find someone who takes me into consideration, and can actually have a truthful conversation. Someone farther along the evolutionary path, if that's a fair statement.

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Re: Healing-Prayer Request

Post by Sandy » Mon Jul 28, 2014 3:40 am

Dear Michele,
I found your post so helpful and insightful. When I evaluate my first husband I can see he had an enormous range...and Desideratum I too found myself apologizing just to make peace and in effect get him to swing to the far right which if I were being honest wasn't very far that way at all. Yet, since I am being honest, I am trying to view my own range as well and can see that I am no picnic. :D ;) :)

This conversation really makes you think...
hugs everybody :hithere
Sandy
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~ Chief Seattle ~

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